[diveinfo] [trey@gavinscooters.com: Re: [gavinscooters] time depht gauge & buddy]
Jean-Sebastien Morisset
diveinfo@lists.mvlan.net
Tue, 29 Nov 2005 15:34:38 -0500
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Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2005 11:26:01 -0800
From: "Trey Irvine" <trey@gavinscooters.com>
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Subject: Re: [gavinscooters] time depht gauge & buddy
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Paul, if there is any question about breathing a gas at a depth, you don't do it. If you have done a dive that is dependent on exact deco in the ocean and find yourself in this situation ( all alone decompressing) , then as I said in my first post on the subject, you are not doing the dive correctly in the first place.
Billy Deans used to carry all kinds of crap with him on his dives offshore of Key West. He had epirbs, cell phones, knives, timers, and all kinds of "redundant" devices everywhere, and he even carried a mirror to use as a signal reflector and to look at his valves. I told him that what he really needed was to start following Rule Number One, simply because no amount of gear or other devices can overcome the consequences of not doing so, of improper dive planning, and of allowing fools in your presence.
If you look at the history of accidents offshore, as well as in caves or confined areas, the common denominator is always an obvious violation of simple DIR priciples, usually of Rule Number One, often failure to use Option Number One, and invariably was doomed from the start due to the plan in place.
On one of the worst of the lost at sea cases down here, where three people died, the dive was doomed from the start. The dive was planned with about a 90 minute run time to start about two hours before dark five miles offshore on the edge of the Gulfstream in a 4 knot current. Lift bags were shot from the bottom and ripped out of divers' hands, buddies were separated, the boat had only a captain and no crew, the boat followed a dead flag, the deco weenies failed to surface long enough to tell the boat that the divers were separated, the boat failed to call the Coast Guard when the captain realized he was off his divers, it got dark and then it was all over , and the bottom line is that no amount of redundant anything would have helped this situation.
People who worry about all the insignificant things pose a big risk of missing the important things when the time comes to deal with a problem. This is why I adhere to Rule Number One religiously. As you pointed out, I might have some skill based on years of experience, but my real skill is in seeing the whole picture, discarding the bullshit, and focusing in on what is really important. I am not saying you can not carry as many timing devices as you want, but I am saying that I personally have never seen the need, but then I don't let that need get created for me, either.
-----Original message-----
From: Paul Braunbehrens bakalite@mac.com
Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2005 10:07:19 -0800
To: gavinscooters@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [gavinscooters] time depht gauge & buddy
> I know my view on this is unpopular in DIR circles, but I firmly
> believe that it makes sense to carry 2 devices that tell time and
> depth. These devices are now so small as to make any argument about
> x-mas trees irrelevant. There certainly are a lot of ways one can
> deal with not having any depth gauges, so I don't think you need 2 to
> dive. However, if your timing/depth device is screwed, and you have
> lost your buddy, (2 failures), then you're already well on the road
> to a clusterfuck. Having another time/depth device in that case is
> VERY nice, take it from someone who's been there, and DIDN'T have one.
>
> As for needing to know exact depth, etc., I agree that this is not
> very important for deco in general, however, I think exact depth is
> important if you are doing an O2 stop. You could argue that you
> could just hang it on backgas instead, or shoot a bag, but remember,
> you have already lost your buddy and your timing device is
> unreliable. I for one, in that situation, would like to get the fuck
> out of the water ASAP, locate my buddy, and make sure everything is OK.
>
> Yeah, yeah, losing your buddy is not acceptable, blah blah blah. We
> all make mistakes sometimes. Also, we are not all as proficient in
> the water as Trey. I'm sure Trey would have no trouble in the
> aforementioned situation, but someone who just finished Tech 1 might.
>
> If you're really worried about looking like a x-mas tree because you
> have a depth capable watch next to the old Uwatec, then just put it
> in your pocket. If you do wear a watch that doesn't show depth as
> well, then that's just plain stupid in my opinion, since there is no
> downside to using one that also shows depth.
>
> I'm sure I'll get flamed for this, but if it prevents someone from
> going through what I did, then it's worth it.
>
>
> On Nov 28, 2005, at 1:58 AM, pepito Sbazzeguti wrote:
>
>> Yasterday, after a dive we was talking about a casualties occured
>> me and my buddy few mounth ago:during a wreck dive, we was just
>> landing on the wreck, and my buddy noticed that is timer& depth/
>> gauge was broken...
>> For us separation is no issue and then we continue the dive using
>> my timer& depth/gauge..one in one time can be enough..
>> This is still my opinion but in the boat yasterday someone didn't
>> agree with me ..
>> What do you think about??
>> Best wishes Pepito
>>
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Jean-Sebastien Morisset, Sr. UNIX Administrator <jsmoriss@mvlan.net>
Personal Home Page <http://jsmoriss.mvlan.net/>
Underwater and Travel Photographs <http://www.mvpix.com/>